Skills vs. Theory, Round 1000 (Was: Re: [UAFlug] lectures)

[Christine Kluka]

Thanks for the run-down...I've done mostly Internet/self-training on
Linux sysadmin, but will have to move to the next level at some point,
and since I can't afford a full CS degree, it's good to know there are
courses you can take to help understand programming languages without
the full 4-year program.  

For the record, you asked me to post my interest in mysql to the forum,
so I'm doing that now.  I work with Gallery and Wordpress, both of which
use mysql databases, although my biggest headaches are the GUIs and
their confusing layers of PHP scripts.


On Mon, 2006-10-23 at 11:15 -0800, Joshua J. Kugler wrote:
> On Saturday 21 October 2006 11:45, Paul Swanson wrote:
> > I think the cs classes at uaf are too abstract/theoretical. Not
> > practical at all. I work at a computery job, and haven't been able to
> > apply anything from my seven or so cs classes.
> >
> > Things I could learn a lot from are networking (how networks are set
> > up, how servers do stuff, what domains are, how roaming profiles work,
> > etc.). Also batch scripts/languages (like Ruby and Perl ;-) ).
> 
> This has been hashed out many, many times, but I'll jump into the fray again.  
> If you want a foundation in computer science, and the ability to learn: get a 
> CS degree.  If you just want the skills you need for a job, take a class for 
> it (or read it on the web, see also: 
> http://www.tvc.uaf.edu/programs/infotech/index.html).  But as to practical 
> skills, the CS program does offer many.  If you want to program, take 
> Operating Systems (321) and Assembly (301, I think).  Architecture (4??) is a 
> good one too.  Those classes will make understanding your programming so much 
> easier, because you'll understand what the system is doing as your program 
> executes.  If you want to be a network guru, take CS 442 first (I'm taking it 
> this semester, 642, actually.).  Will it teach you to set up a windows AD 
> network and configure roaming profiles?  No, but it will give you a base-line 
> knowledge level that will make understanding how that network works, and 
> troubleshooting that network, so much easier.
> 
> I've taken the full complement of CS classes to earn my BS, and almost my MS.  
> There are classes I may never use again.  But I'm glad I had CS 201/202 (I've 
> used C/C++ since in job and school); 301 (understanding of a computer's 
> operation); 331/631 (better understanding of how compilers work, and the 
> complexities thereof; 401 (senior project, better understanding of process 
> and project management); Computer Architecture (gives me a good idea of how 
> all the hardware fits together so I understand the system better when working 
> on it); 311 (will I being doing heavy algorithm design, maybe, but I also 
> know I can evaluate possible algorithms for efficiency and the load they will 
> put on the system); 321 (especially helps when running on "sane" systems such 
> as Linux); 447 (software engineering: gave me so much insight into the proper 
> ways to go about designing programs.  Something I'm about to put into heavy 
> use at my current job); and there are others.
> 
> Among the things I've learned on my own or via "on the job training": Perl; 
> SQL; Visual Basic; Linux administration; Apache administration; Postfix 
> administration; a little Sendmail too; General system administration; Network 
> setup, with some routing (Todd Medbury could make my head hurt); 
> hardware/software troubleshooting/assembly; Qt programming; CGI/web 
> programming; Bind (DNS Server); HTML; VMWare Server; Bacula (backup server);  
> as well as other skills I've probably failed to mention.  I'm not bragging, 
> I'm simply pointing out that taking classes in all those would have been 
> prohibitively expensive, and taken a LOT of time.
> 
> For another example of what all that theory got me, see 
> http://asuaf.org/~joshua/papers/voting_virtually.pdf  Careful design and 
> development led to a successful election with software that was designed, 
> coded, and debugged (very little debugging, due to careful coding) in 80 
> hours.
> 
> My point is, with a  CS degree from UAF (or another college that is more on 
> the theory side), you will be able to drop into any job and pick up the 
> skills quickly.  With a purely skills-based degree, if you do not have the 
> learn-on-your-own-itude that is needed in this industry, you will be totally 
> lost when faced with a new paradigm or language.
> 
> Bottom line: if one requires a university class to learn a job skill, then a 
> CS degree won't do one much good in the real world, whether theoretical or 
> practical.
> 
> My 0.02 monetary units.
> 
> j
> 
> -- 
> Joshua Kugler                           
> Lead System Admin -- Senior Programmer
> http://www.eeinternet.com
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